Afrikaans: Geseënde Kersfees
Albanees: Gëzuar Krishtlindjet
Armeniaans: Շնորհավոր �ուրբ Ծնունդ
Azarbediaans: Milad bayramınız mübarək
Baskisch: Eguberri on
Bengaals: শুভ বড়দিন
Bosnisch: sretan božić
Bulgaars: Весела Коледа
Catalaans: Bon Nadal
Cebuanao: maayong Pasko
Chichewa: Khrisimasi yabwino
Chinees: 聖誕節快樂
Chinees: 圣诞节快乐
Corsicaans: Bon natale
Deens: glædelig jul
Duits: Fröhliche Weihnachten
Engels: Merry Christmas
Esparanto: feliĉan Kristnaskon
Ests: häid jõule
Fins: hyvää joulua
Frans: joyeux Noël
Fries: noflike krystdagen
Galicisch: feliz Nadal
Grieks: καλά Χριστο�γεννα
Hausa: Merry Kirsimeti
Hawaïaans: Mele kalikimaka
Hebreeuws: חג מולד שמח
Hindi: क�रिसमस की बधाई
Hongaars: boldog Karácsonyt
Iers: Nollaig Shona
Igbo: ezi ekeresimesi
IJslands: Gleðileg jól
Indonesisch: Selamat Natal
Italiaans: buon Natale
Japans: メリークリスマス
Jiddisch: לעבעדיק ניטל
Kazachs: Рождество құтты болсын
Kirgizisch: Рождество майрамы менен
Koerdisch: Kirîstmas piroz be
Kroatisch: sretan Božić
Latijn: felicem natalem Christi
Lets: Priecīgus Ziemassvētkus
Litouws: linksmų Kalėdų
Luxemburgs: Schéi Chrëschtdeeg
Macedonisch: среќен Божиќ
Mlagasi: tratry ny krismasy
Maleis: Selamat Hari Natal
Maltees: il-Milied it-tajjeb
Marati: मेरी ख�रिसमस
Nederlands: Vrolijk Kerstfeest
Noors: god jul
Oekraïens: щасливого Різдва
Oezbeeks: Rojdestvo bilan
Perzisch: کریسمس مبارک
Pools: Wesołych Świąt
Portugees: Feliz Natal
Roemeens: Craciun Fericit
Russisch: счастливого Рождества
Samoaans: Manuia le kirisimasi
Schots: Nollaig Chridheil
Servisch: срећан Божић
Sesoto: kereseme e monate
Shona: Kisimusi yakanaka
Slovaaks: veselé Vianoce
Solveens: vesel boži�

Soedanees: Wilujeng Natal
Somalisch: yuul
Spaans: Feliz Navidad
Swahili: Krismasi
Tadzjieks: мавлуди Исо муборак
Tagalog: Maligayang Pasko
Thai: สุขสันต์วันคริสต์มาส
Tsjechisch: veselé Vánoce
Turks: mutlu Noeller
Vietnamees: Giáng sinh vui vẻ
Wels: Nadolig Llawen
Wit Russisch: з Калядамі
Xhosa: Ikrismesi emnandi
Yoruba: ikini �dun keresimesi
Zulu: Jabulela Ukhisimusi
Zweeds: god Jul

--- GoldED+/W32-MINGW 1.1.5-b20110320
* Origin: Blijf Tønijn (2:280/5555)

Hello Michiel,

On Fri Dec 23 2016 20:27:16, Michiel van der Vlist wrote to All:

@TID: FMail-W32 1.73.9.54-B20161212
@TZUTC: 0100
@CHRS: UTF-8 4
@MSGID: 2:280/5555 585d7ac4

--- GoldED+/W32-MINGW 1.1.5-b20110320
* Origin: Blijf Tønijn (2:280/5555)
SEEN-BY: 153/7001 154/10 700 203/0 240/1120 249/303 280/464 5003 5555 310/31
SEEN-BY: 712/848 5019/40 5020/12000 5075/35
@PATH: 280/5555 154/10

Just keeping the relevant parts, but do you by chance post your UTF-8 messages two ways? I see some posts with an "X-RFC-NoArchive" kludge, and some without. I seem to have a lot less issues with the messages you post that do include that kludge, even though it has nothing to do with UTF-8.

As you can see above in your origin line, it didn't display correctly in this specific message, but in other messages it displays as it should.

Regards,
Nick

--- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20161221
* Origin: thePharcyde_ distribution system (Wisconsin) (1:154/10)

Hello Nicholas,

On Friday December 23 2016 18:10, you wrote to me:

--- GoldED+/W32-MINGW 1.1.5-b20110320
# Origin: Blijf Tønijn (2:280/5555)

Looks OK to me.

Just keeping the relevant parts, but do you by chance post your UTF-8 messages two ways?

Three ways actually.

I see some posts with an "X-RFC-NoArchive" kludge,

and some without. I seem to have a lot less issues with the messages
you post that do include that kludge, even though it has nothing to do with UTF-8.

I have two different setups for Golded using UTF-8. The one is the regular config I also use for CP850. Golded uses the CP850 to UTF-8

The other is configured for using WInvi as external editor. Golded itself does no translation at all, other than a 1 to 1 translateion tabel to set the level parameter in the CHRS kludge to 4. This message is typed that awy. It does not always come out as I wish.

The third type are robot postings. They are posted by Ftools, who itself is characterset agnostic.

Cheers, Michiel

--- GoldED+/W32-MINGW 1.1.5-b20110320
* Origin: Blijf Tønijn (2:280/5555)

Hello Michiel,

On Sat Dec 24 2016 01:29:16, Michiel van der Vlist wrote to Nicholas Boel:

--- GoldED+/W32-MINGW 1.1.5-b20110320
# Origin: Blijf Tønijn (2:280/5555)

Looks OK to me.

It did after I replied as well, although your original message looked funky on my end. Not sure if Golded attempted to translate it or something, but quoting your Merry Christmas in different languages gave me a bunch of wierd "<B3>" type stuff - which in the end still displayed properly, but just odd I saw it that way.

I have two different setups for Golded using UTF-8. The one is the
regular config I also use for CP850. Golded uses the CP850 to UTF-8

I just wonder what you used to post the "Merry Christmas" in many different languages with. When I tried replying to it, I had a bunch of odd characters, which still ended up translating to proper UTF-8 in the end, but.. just wierd I sometimes see messages like this, and others perfectly normal.

The other is configured for using WInvi as external editor. Golded
itself does no translation at all, other than a 1 to 1 translateion
tabel to set the level parameter in the CHRS kludge to 4. This message
is typed that awy. It does not always come out as I wish.

That's how I'm setup here, for the most part. I translate all charsets to UTF-8 that I possibly can, and then the last is just a simple utf8_utf8.chs that has no translations, but sets the level parameter and leaves 255 blank lines with "END" afterwards.

--- GoldED+/W32-MINGW 1.1.5-b20110320
* Origin: Blijf Tønijn (2:280/5555)

For the record, this one looks fine.

Regards,
Nick

... "Не знаю. Я здесь только работаю."
--- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20161221
* Origin: thePharcyde_ distribution system (Wisconsin) (1:154/10)

-={ 2016-12-23 20:03:22.838533533-06:00 }=-

Hey Nicholas!

although your original message looked funky on my end

I am reading that you are using terminal fonts and thus characters that do not have a correspoding font for will show as an inverted wuestion mark or something similar, for example his Origin line which has two U+0133 characters which I lack a font for; LATIN SMALL LIGATURE IJ. Same with many of the languages, 24 bit Chinese characters come to mind, in the "Merry Christmas" post. However the way I have vim set up with a status line with the decimal and unicode values for the character above the cursor, is a great way to verify that they are indeed utf-8 characters despite they cannot be displayed by a terminal font - I use LatGrkCyr-12x22 which works for 99.99% of the supposed supported languages in fidonet.

The statusline in the default /etc/vimrc is as follows;

set statusline=%<%f%h%m%r%=%b\ U+%04B\ \ %l,%v\ %P

where the %b gives the decimal value and the U+%04B part yeilds the utf-8 value. "307 U+0133" for the characters in his Origin line. To replicate it all I need to do is hold leftAlt and enter 307 on the number pad on the keyboard which results in -> ij. It still is an inverted question mark but it should be LATIN SMALL LIGATURE IJ on a display that can reproduce that character.

Life is good,
Maurice

... Nearon nu cyningas ne caseras ne goldgiefan swylce iu wæron.
There are not now kings nor caesars nor gold-givers as there once were.
--- GNU bash, version 4.4.5(1)-release (x86_64-atom-linux-gnu)
* Origin: Little Mikey's Brain - Ladysmith BC, Canada (1:153/7001)

Hello Maurice,

On Sat Dec 24 2016 02:03:22, Maurice Kinal wrote to Nicholas Boel:

although your original message looked funky on my end

The statusline in the default /etc/vimrc is as follows;

set statusline=%<%f%h%m%r%=%b\ U+%04B\ \ %l,%v\ %P

I'll take a look, although I don't think it pertains much to what I'm referring to. I'm seeing some wierd things, but I'm definitely going to blame it on Golded and it's conversions. I've setup JamNNTPd and use slrn to access it - with all charsets translated to UTF-8, and in a full UTF-8 environment, everything works quite a bit better (display-wise) than Golded. It'll just take a bit to get used to using slrn when being used to Golded. Small price to pay though.

where the %b gives the decimal value and the U+%04B part yeilds the
utf-8 value. "307 U+0133" for the characters in his Origin line. To replicate it all I need to do is hold leftAlt and enter 307 on the
number pad on the keyboard which results in -> ij. It still is an inverted question mark but it should be LATIN SMALL LIGATURE IJ on a display that can reproduce that character.

I see everything properly now using putty to access my NNTP server, and slrn with ter-v22b as my font. I even see Chinese, Thai, Armenian, and all the others posted in that Christmas post by Michiel. There were actually probably 10 or less characters that didn't display properly in that entire message. However, Golded's translation seems to do different things depending on what editor Michiel uses to write his messages, which I'm trying to figure out, is all.

Regards,
Nick

... "Не знаю. Я здесь только работаю."
--- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20161221
* Origin: thePharcyde_ distribution system (Wisconsin) (1:154/10)

-={ 2016-12-23 23:55:10.705376230-06:00 }=-

Hey Nicholas!

I don't think it pertains much to what I'm referring to

It now seems that way.

everything works quite a bit better (display-wise) than Golded

That I believe.

using putty to access my NNTP server

On a linux box? I see from the source that it requires a gui, uses gtk as a dependency, so it isn't a true hardcore console based terminal application which explains why you can see Chinese characters displayed. putty emulates an xterm on linux from my understanding of it as opposed to the linux terminal sans xorg which is what I am currently using.

Life is good,
Maurice

... Meotud ana wat hwær se cwealm cymeþ, þe heonon of cyþþe gewiteþ.
Only God knows where plague goes when it departs from a place.
--- GNU bash, version 4.4.5(1)-release (x86_64-atom-linux-gnu)
* Origin: Little Mikey's Brain - Ladysmith BC, Canada (1:153/7001)

Hello Nicholas,

On Friday December 23 2016 19:54, you wrote to me:

something, but quoting your Merry Christmas in different languages
gave me a bunch of wierd "<B3>" type stuff - which in the end still displayed properly, but just odd I saw it that way.

What do you mean by "<B3> type stuff"?

I just wonder what you used to post the "Merry Christmas" in many different languages with.

I first created an utf-8 text file with winvi. I fired up Google translate and cut and pasted the translations into the file.

I saved the file.

I fired up Golded in what I call "g8 mode". In its config file there is are translation files declared, except for the dummy translation file that takes care of the level 4 parameter.

I started a new message and I imported the text file into the message body with "Alt i". I saved the message with control Z. That's it.


Cheers, Michiel

--- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
* Origin: Blijf Tønijn (2:280/5555)

Hello Maurice,

On Sat, 24 Dec 2016 11:55:10 GMT, Maurice Kinal -> Nicholas Boel wrote:

using putty to access my NNTP server

On a linux box? I see from the source that it requires a gui, uses gtk
as a dependency, so it isn't a true hardcore console based terminal application which explains why you can see Chinese characters displayed. putty emulates an xterm on linux from my understanding of it as opposed
to the linux terminal sans xorg which is what I am currently using.

No. I'm running Putty on my gaming computer that runs Windows 10. I ssh to my RasPi3 where the NNTP client and server reside and run slrn which then connects to the NNTP server to read messages, and executes vim to write/reply to them. Works great and I can read and write anything I want to in regards to UTF-8 now, without hardcore console limitations!

.. Meotud ana wat hwær se cwealm cymeþ, þe heonon of cyþþe gewiteþ.
Only God knows where plague goes when it departs from a place.

As long as it doesn't show up here, I don't need to know. :)

Regards,
Nick

--- slrn/1.0.3 (Linux)
* Origin: thePharcyde_ distribution system (1:154/10)

Hello Michiel,

On Sat, 24 Dec 2016 13:14:48 +0100, Michiel van der Vlist -> Nicholas Boel wrote:

something, but quoting your Merry Christmas in different languages
gave me a bunch of wierd "<B3>" type stuff - which in the end still
displayed properly, but just odd I saw it that way.

MvdV> What do you mean by "<B3> type stuff"?

I've created two screenshots, one in vim when I reply to your original message (what is displayed to me which was what I saw as "odd"), and one of slrn reading your original message. As you can see, Golded doesn't translate it very well. Many of your other messages are translated just fine and I don't see any of that wierdness, though.

Also, you can see in the slrn screenshot, there is a random <D5> in the third line. Although there are MUCH fewer of these in the slrn screenshot than there are in the golded screenshot (This is what golded wrote to MSGTMP when opening in vim).

https://pharcyde.org/files/golded_screenshot.png https://pharcyde.org/files/slrn_screenshot.png

I just wonder what you used to post the "Merry Christmas" in many
different languages with.

MvdV> I first created an utf-8 text file with winvi. I fired up Google
MvdV> translate and cut and pasted the translations into the file.

MvdV> I saved the file.

MvdV> I fired up Golded in what I call "g8 mode". In its config file there is
MvdV> are translation files declared, except for the dummy translation file
MvdV> that takes care of the level 4 parameter.

MvdV> I started a new message and I imported the text file into the message
MvdV> body with "Alt i". I saved the message with control Z. That's it.

I don't know what the deal is. That specific message seemed to be translated by Golded differently on my end than most other UTF-8 messages, so I figured I'd ask what method you took.

Regards,
Nick

--- slrn/1.0.3 (Linux)
* Origin: thePharcyde_ distribution system (1:154/10)

-={ 2016-12-24 10:24:20.886796727-06:00 }=-

Hey Nicholas!

I'm running Putty on my gaming computer that runs Windows 10.

:::shudder:::

I ssh to my RasPi3 where the NNTP client and server reside

That explains why it works. MS products require a proper server to take care of the real business.

without hardcore console limitations!

xterm apps could do the same if one were to take advantage of that. From my limited understanding putty is an xterm emulator with builtin encrytion.

.. Meotud ana wat hwær se cwealm cymeþ, þe heonon of cyþþe gewiteþ.
Only God knows where plague goes when it departs from a place.

As long as it doesn't show up here, I don't need to know. :)

That was obviously written long before the CDC and the like existed. I am certain the Anglo-Saxons had no such thing.

Anyhow you shouldn't see any C1 control codes such as <B3> in them. ;-)

Life is good,
Maurice

... Draca sceal on hlæwe, frod, frætwum wlanc.
A dragon belongs in a barrow, old, proud in its treasures.
--- GNU bash, version 4.4.5(1)-release (x86_64-atom-linux-gnu)
* Origin: Little Mikey's Brain - Ladysmith BC, Canada (1:153/7001)

Hello Maurice,

On Sat, 24 Dec 2016 22:24:20 GMT, Maurice Kinal -> Nicholas Boel wrote:

Anyhow you shouldn't see any C1 control codes such as <B3> in them. ;-)

.. Draca sceal on hlæwe, frod, frætwum wlanc.
A dragon belongs in a barrow, old, proud in its treasures.

I never have in any of the messages you've written, nor have I seen anything like that in *most* messages Michiel writes. That's why I questioned that specific message. Either way, Golded is most likely to blame, since slrn read 99% of it just fine.

Regards,
Nick

--- slrn/1.0.3 (Linux)
* Origin: thePharcyde_ distribution system (1:154/10)

-={ 2016-12-24 22:54:54.266483963-06:00 }=-

Hey Nicholas!

I never have in any of the messages you've written

There were some NBSP's in the old english taglines which are near impossible to spot in vim since they masquerade as regular spaces. I am pretty sure I got them all ... now.

Golded is most likely to blame

Probably. :::evil grin:::

Also some people often confuse cp1252 for latin1 which can cause much grief with the actual latin1 encoding iso8859-1. That is the usual suspect but I've also seen some weirdness created amongst the IBM codepages as well. Personally I avoid them all and only use utf-8 which includes the 7 bit ascii characters.

Life is good,
Maurice

... Weorða ðe selfne godum dædum, ðenden ðin God recce.
Bring honour to yourself with good deeds, while God guides you.
--- GNU bash, version 4.4.5(1)-release (x86_64-atom-linux-gnu)
* Origin: Little Mikey's Brain - Ladysmith BC, Canada (1:153/7001)

Hello Nicholas,

On Saturday December 24 2016 09:35, you wrote to me:

MvdV>> What do you mean by "<B3> type stuff"?

I've created two screenshots, one in vim when I reply to your original message (what is displayed to me which was what I saw as "odd"), and
one of slrn reading your original message. As you can see, Golded
doesn't translate it very well. Many of your other messages are
translated just fine and I don't see any of that wierdness, though.

It is not Golded, Golded should be configured to do no translation at all. It is your terminal that is configured for ISO-8859-1 (Latin1) instead of UTF-8. Force it to UTF-8.

Also, you can see in the slrn screenshot, there is a random <D5> in
the third line.

In Winvi I see a character that displays like an upper case 'U'. In hexmode I can see that it s encoded as D5 8D. Somewher in the chain the 8D (Soft Return) is removed. What remains is a not well formed UTF-8 sequence.

Configure your tosser/reader/editor to not remove softreurns and treat them as printable.


Cheers, Michiel

--- GoldED+/W32-MINGW 1.1.5-b20110320
* Origin: Blijf Tønijn (2:280/5555)

Hello Michiel,

On Sun Dec 25 2016 16:17:06, Michiel van der Vlist wrote to Nicholas Boel:

It is not Golded, Golded should be configured to do no translation at
all. It is your terminal that is configured for ISO-8859-1 (Latin1) instead of UTF-8. Force it to UTF-8.

Well, it was in fact Golded specific for most cases. Setting "DISPSOFTCR YES" in my config file seemed to fix the issue with your original message, and displayed the entire thing just fine.

In Winvi I see a character that displays like an upper case 'U'. In hexmode I can see that it s encoded as D5 8D. Somewher in the chain
the 8D (Soft Return) is removed. What remains is a not well formed
UTF-8 sequence.

Configure your tosser/reader/editor to not remove softreurns and treat them as printable.

There may very well be something similar in slrn that I'll have to address, although it is nowhere near as blatantly noticeable as it was in Golded and how Golded wrote out the editorfile to vim.

I guess my question would then be, why include printed soft CRs in messages? Isn't that about as worthless as BOMs?

Regards,
Nick

... "Не знаю. Я здесь только работаю."
--- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20161221
* Origin: thePharcyde_ distribution system (Wisconsin) (1:154/10)

Hello Maurice,

On Sun Dec 25 2016 04:54:54, Maurice Kinal wrote to Nicholas Boel:

There were some NBSP's in the old english taglines which are near impossible to spot in vim since they masquerade as regular spaces. I
am pretty sure I got them all ... now.

You should probably pat yourself on the back then! :)

Golded is most likely to blame

Probably. :::evil grin:::

Also some people often confuse cp1252 for latin1 which can cause much grief with the actual latin1 encoding iso8859-1. That is the usual suspect but I've also seen some weirdness created amongst the IBM codepages as well. Personally I avoid them all and only use utf-8
which includes the 7 bit ascii characters.

I had to change a setting in Golded and all seems fine now. Although I still wonder why printed soft CRs are necessary.

*shrug*

Oh well.

Regards,
Nick

... "Не знаю. Я здесь только работаю."
--- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20161221
* Origin: thePharcyde_ distribution system (Wisconsin) (1:154/10)

-={ 2016-12-25 10:52:59.203508806-06:00 }=-

Hey Nicholas!

You should probably pat yourself on the back then!

I am holding out for the cash.

I still wonder why printed soft CRs are necessary.

If I had to guess I'd have to say limited line lengths in DOS-think software. If I am not mistaken 25-ish odd years ago (back when it mattered) it was 256 characters. Mind you after witnessing same really oddball wordwrapping lately I have to wonder if it is actually leakage from the host system's display width.

Life is good,
Maurice

... Feorcyþðe beoð selran gesohte þæm þe him selfa deah.
Distant lands are best sought by one who is worthy in himself.
--- GNU bash, version 4.4.5(1)-release (x86_64-atom-linux-gnu)
* Origin: Little Mikey's Brain - Ladysmith BC, Canada (1:153/7001)

Hello Nicholas,

On Sunday December 25 2016 10:08, you wrote to me:

I guess my question would then be, why include printed soft CRs in messages? Isn't that about as worthless as BOMs?

This soft return thing is a 45+ year old relic from the CP/M era that keeps haunting us till today. In FTS-1 it is documented as a control character which was a mistake that should never have happened. Current practise is and has been for over two decades that it is not a control character but a printable character. In CP437 and CP860 it is the 'i' with accent grave. ì In CP866 it is the characters that looks look 'H' and which is pronounced as 'N' in Russian.

In UTF-8 0x8D can be part of a valid multi byte well formed UTF08 sequence.

In 99.99% of cyber space the soft CR has been extinct for decades, but in Fidonet there unfortunately is still some stone age software around that threats it as a control character and it can not be persuaded not to do so. Telegard comes to mind. As you have already discovered Golded can be taught to do it right. Some tossers also have a configuration option to strip or not strip soft returns.

Anyway, for proper UTF-8 support all software should be configured to not treat 0x8D as a control character. And if it can not be configured that way, it should be nominated for the Darwin Award...


Cheers, Michiel

--- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
* Origin: Blijf Tønijn (2:280/5555)

Hello Maurice,

On Sun Dec 25 2016 16:52:58, Maurice Kinal wrote to Nicholas Boel:

You should probably pat yourself on the back then!

I am holding out for the cash.

I would too!

I still wonder why printed soft CRs are necessary.

If I had to guess I'd have to say limited line lengths in DOS-think software. If I am not mistaken 25-ish odd years ago (back when it mattered) it was 256 characters. Mind you after witnessing same
really oddball wordwrapping lately I have to wonder if it is actually leakage from the host system's display width.

Could be. Although it was mentioned that a copy/paste from the web (Google translate) was involved, as well as importing a text file to Golded, so who knows. I rarely saw the issue before this one time, and those issues were because of no CHRS kludge and/or my software not being able to translate from "unknown-8bit" to UTF-8 (usually CP437 messages that are not actually marked as such).

Obviously only nit-picking going on at this point. :)

Regards,
Nick

... "Не знаю. Я здесь только работаю."
--- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20161221
* Origin: thePharcyde_ distribution system (Wisconsin) (1:154/10)

Hello Michiel,

On Mon Dec 26 2016 00:34:22, Michiel van der Vlist wrote to Nicholas Boel:

In 99.99% of cyber space the soft CR has been extinct for decades, but
in Fidonet there unfortunately is still some stone age software around that threats it as a control character and it can not be persuaded not
to do so. Telegard comes to mind. As you have already discovered
Golded can be taught to do it right. Some tossers also have a configuration option to strip or not strip soft returns.

I didn't even look at HPT yet, but since using the option in Golded, I haven't seen any inconsistancies yet.

Anyway, for proper UTF-8 support all software should be configured to
not treat 0x8D as a control character. And if it can not be configured that way, it should be nominated for the Darwin Award...

:)

Regards,
Nick

... "Не знаю. Я здесь только работаю."
--- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20161221
* Origin: thePharcyde_ distribution system (Wisconsin) (1:154/10)

-={ 2016-12-26 16:28:28.688838814-06:00 }=-

Hey Nicholas!

Although it was mentioned that a copy/paste from the web (Google translate) was involved

AH! Yeah that can screw codes up, especially nonLatin ones.

as well as importing a text file to Golded

I don't recall ever trying that but I have done it in msged with success. It was only when msged wrote the file where things went wrong.

translate from "unknown-8bit" to UTF-8 (usually CP437 messages
that are not actually marked as such).

As a rule I don't bother even if it is known. Around this part of the world it is usually cp1252 but there are still a few cp437 hangouts. Usually those are mostly the ansi art types.

Life is good,
Maurice

... Ða ne sacað þe ætsamne ne beoð.
They do not quarrel who are not together.
--- GNU bash, version 4.4.5(1)-release (x86_64-atom-linux-gnu)
* Origin: Little Mikey's Brain - Ladysmith BC, Canada (1:153/7001)