• Long

    From Denis Mosko@2:5064/54.1315 to All on Wed Mar 20 16:49:48 2019
    Hi, All!

    Correct, please:

    The cat, which walking by herself.


    --- GoldED+/W32-MINGW 1.1.5-b20120519 (Kubik 3.0)
    * Origin: Living in interesting times. (2:5064/54.1315)
  • From mark lewis@1:3634/12.73 to Denis Mosko on Wed Mar 20 12:43:58 2019
    On 2019 Mar 20 16:49:48, you wrote to All:

    Correct, please:

    The cat, which walking by herself.

    that looks like an incomplete sentence but if it isn't, i'd use

    The cat was walking by itself.

    i used "itself" since we don't know the sex of the cat... but if we do, then "himself" for male or "herself" for female is OK...

    )\/(ark

    Always Mount a Scratch Monkey
    Do you manage your own servers? If you are not running an IDS/IPS yer doin' it wrong...
    ... I've read some modern free verse and wonder who set it free.
    ---
    * Origin: (1:3634/12.73)
  • From Denis Mosko@2:5064/54.1315 to mark lewis on Wed Mar 20 20:41:32 2019
    [...cus'...]
    Correct, please:

    The cat, which walking by herself.

    that looks like an incomplete sentence but if it isn't, i'd use

    The cat was walking by itself.

    i used "itself" since we don't know the sex of the cat... but if we
    do, then "himself" for male or "herself" for female is OK...
    Or ^^^ - men (not women) ?

    2All: What is correct: New York DC
    or
    Washinton DC?

    Always Mount a Scratch Monkey
    :)

    --- GoldED+/W32-MINGW 1.1.5-b20120519 (Kubik 3.0)
    * Origin: Living in interesting times. (2:5064/54.1315)
  • From Alexander Koryagin@2:221/6 to mark lewis on Wed Mar 20 21:10:22 2019
    Hi, Mark Lewis : Denis Mosko!
    I read your message from 20.03.2019 19:43

    Correct, please:
    The cat, which walking by herself.
    that looks like an incomplete sentence but if it isn't, i'd use
    The cat was walking by itself.
    i used "itself" since we don't know the sex of the cat... but if we
    do, then "himself" for male or "herself" for female is OK...

    I thought that in English "cat" is male, like a ship is female. ;)

    "The cat, which walking by herself," is probably taken from a story for children, where they are told how the cat had become a domestic animal. The cat
    there could talk, and when the ancient woman invited him into the cave, he always replied, "I am a cat. I am walking alone and everywhere I want to." ;-) Do you have this story in the English literature?

    Bye, Mark!
    Alexander Koryagin
    english_tutor 2019

    ---
    * Origin: nntps://fidonews.mine.nu - Lake Ylo - Finland (2:221/6.0)
  • From mark lewis@1:3634/12.73 to Denis Mosko on Thu Mar 21 06:25:28 2019
    On 2019 Mar 20 20:41:32, you wrote to me:

    [...cus'...]
    Correct, please:

    The cat, which walking by herself.

    that looks like an incomplete sentence but if it isn't, i'd use

    The cat was walking by itself.

    i used "itself" since we don't know the sex of the cat... but if we
    do, then "himself" for male or "herself" for female is OK...
    Or ^^^ - men (not women) ?

    "him" is male only... "her" is female only...

    2All: What is correct: New York DC
    or
    Washinton DC?

    DC is District of Columbia... the only city in DC is Washington...

    New York is either the state or a city/town... certainly not in DC...

    )\/(ark

    Always Mount a Scratch Monkey
    Do you manage your own servers? If you are not running an IDS/IPS yer doin' it wrong...
    ... I am curious. What is the etymology of that idiom?
    ---
    * Origin: (1:3634/12.73)
  • From mark lewis@1:3634/12.73 to Alexander Koryagin on Thu Mar 21 06:29:08 2019
    On 2019 Mar 20 21:10:22, you wrote to me:

    Correct, please:
    The cat, which walking by herself.
    that looks like an incomplete sentence but if it isn't, i'd use
    The cat was walking by itself.
    i used "itself" since we don't know the sex of the cat... but if we
    do, then "himself" for male or "herself" for female is OK...

    I thought that in English "cat" is male, like a ship is female. ;)

    no, cats are animals and animated objects... ships, cars, trains are not animals and are inanimate objects...

    but it depends on the context, too... there are instances where "cat" may not be referencing an animal...

    eg: that guy is a cool cat, man!

    "The cat, which walking by herself," is probably taken from a story
    for children, where they are told how the cat had become a domestic animal.

    that's why i said it looked like an incomplete sentence... you have two commas in your snippet whereas the original post had a comma and ended in a period...

    The cat there could talk, and when the ancient woman invited him into
    the cave, he always replied, "I am a cat. I am walking alone and everywhere I want to." ;-) Do you have this story in the English literature?

    not that i'm aware of but it has been a very long time since i read any children's books...

    )\/(ark

    Always Mount a Scratch Monkey
    Do you manage your own servers? If you are not running an IDS/IPS yer doin' it wrong...
    ... A professor is one who talks in someone else's sleep.
    ---
    * Origin: (1:3634/12.73)
  • From nathanael culver@3:712/886 to Denis Mosko on Thu Mar 21 22:13:08 2019
    The cat, which walking by herself.

    The ca, which was walking by herself, ...

    靈컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴 靈컴컴컴 靈컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴
    *HUMONGOUS* BBS nathanael : jenandcal.familyds.org:2323
    聃컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴 聃컴컴컴 聃컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A43 2019/03/03 (Raspberry Pi/32)
    * Origin: *HUMONGOUS* BBS (3:712/886)
  • From Alexander Koryagin@2:221/6 to mark lewis on Thu Mar 21 20:49:12 2019
    Hi, Mark Lewis!

    Correct, please: The cat, which walking by herself.
    that looks like an incomplete sentence but if it isn't, i'd use
    The cat was walking by itself. i used "itself" since we don't
    know the sex of the cat... but if we do, then "himself" for male
    or "herself" for female is OK...
    I thought that in English "cat" is male, like a ship is female.

    no, cats are animals and animated objects... ships, cars, trains
    are not animals and are inanimate objects...

    But we can say about a ship:

    Captain Blood, by Sabatini
    -----Beginning of the citation-----
    All day the Dutch brig was in sight, though by evening she had dwindled
    to the merest speck on the northern horizon.
    ----- The end of the citation -----

    but it depends on the context, too... there are instances
    where "cat" may not be referencing an animal...

    eg: that guy is a cool cat, man!

    "The cat, which walking by herself," is probably taken from a
    story for children, where they are told how the cat had become a
    domestic animal.

    that's why i said it looked like an incomplete sentence... you have
    two commas in your snippet whereas the original post had a comma
    and ended in a period...

    The cat there could talk, and when the ancient woman invited him
    into the cave, he always replied, "I am a cat. I am walking alone
    and everywhere I want to." Do you have this story in the English
    literature?

    not that i'm aware of but it has been a very long time since i read
    any children's books...

    As I have learned, the original story was written by Rudyard Kipling, "THE CAT THAT WALKED BY HIMSELF"
    http://www.boop.org/jan/justso/cat.htm

    So he was male? ;)

    We have a cartoon on this subject. ;) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h2P_kWj8bJQ


    Bye, Mark!
    Alexander Koryagin
    english_tutor 2019

    ---
    * Origin: nntps://fidonews.mine.nu - Lake Ylo - Finland (2:221/6.0)
  • From mark lewis@1:3634/12.73 to Alexander Koryagin on Fri Mar 22 10:11:28 2019
    On 2019 Mar 21 20:49:12, you wrote to me:

    not that i'm aware of but it has been a very long time since i read
    any children's books...

    As I have learned, the original story was written by Rudyard Kipling,
    "THE CAT THAT WALKED BY HIMSELF"
    http://www.boop.org/jan/justso/cat.htm

    ahhh, yeah, it was a long long time ago when i read that :)

    So he was male? ;)

    yup...

    We have a cartoon on this subject. ;) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h2P_kWj8bJQ

    :)

    )\/(ark

    Always Mount a Scratch Monkey
    Do you manage your own servers? If you are not running an IDS/IPS yer doin' it wrong...
    ... Do not Disturb; I'm playing with my Mental Blocks.
    ---
    * Origin: (1:3634/12.73)
  • From mark lewis@1:3634/12.73 to Denis Mosko on Fri Mar 22 10:13:26 2019
    On 2019 Mar 21 06:25:28, I wrote to you:

    2All: What is correct: New York DC
    or
    Washinton DC?

    DC is District of Columbia... the only city in DC is Washington...

    New York is either the state or a city/town... certainly not in DC...

    Denis, did you get my routed netmail response to your netmail query about this topic?

    )\/(ark

    Always Mount a Scratch Monkey
    Do you manage your own servers? If you are not running an IDS/IPS yer doin' it wrong...
    ... Philosophy is when psychology leaves the atmosphere.
    ---
    * Origin: (1:3634/12.73)
  • From Mike Powell@1:2320/105 to MARK LEWIS on Fri Mar 22 18:18:00 2019
    I thought that in English "cat" is male, like a ship is female. ;)

    no, cats are animals and animated objects... ships, cars, trains are not animals and are inanimate objects...

    That said, ships and cars are often refered to as females by their
    captains and owners.

    At least traditionally they were... who knows nowadays.

    Mike
    ---
    SLMR 2.1a Golden Rule: He who has the gold makes the rules.
    * Origin: capitolcityonline.net * Telnet/SSH:2022/HTTP (1:2320/105)
  • From Anton Shepelev@2:221/6 to Alexander Koryagin on Sun Jun 23 23:24:20 2019
    Alexander Koryagin:

    The cat, which walking by herself," is probably taken from
    a story for children, where they are told how the cat had
    become a domestic animal. The cat there could talk, and
    when the ancient woman invited him into the cave, he al-
    ways replied, "I am a cat. I am walking alone and every-
    where I want to." ;-) Do you have this story in the En-
    glish literature?

    As sure as sugar is sweet, for none else but Kipling wrote
    it. I haven't read the original, but the Soviet animation
    is very clever and not children at all at all:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NL7PSeN3SYU
    (unfortunately no subtitles)

    Kipling's cat is male whereas its Russian couterpart female,
    probably because such cunning wisdom is here considered a
    feminine trait.

    ---
    * Origin: nntps://fidonews.mine.nu - Lake Ylo - Finland (2:221/6.0)
  • From Anton Shepelev@2:221/6 to Anton Shepelev on Sun Jun 23 23:26:10 2019
    I wrote:

    I haven't read the original, but the Soviet animation is
    very clever and not children at all at all:

    Not *for* childred at all at all.

    ---
    * Origin: nntps://fidonews.mine.nu - Lake Ylo - Finland (2:221/6.0)
  • From Anton Shepelev@2:221/6 to Anton Shepelev on Mon Jun 24 14:46:58 2019
    I wrote:

    I haven't read the original, but the Soviet animation is
    very clever and not children at all at all:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NL7PSeN3SYU
    (unfortunately no subtitles)

    Kipling's cat is male whereas its Russian couterpart
    female, probably because such cunning wisdom is here
    considered a feminine trait.

    I misremenbered, the cat is male in the animation too.

    ---
    * Origin: nntps://fidonews.mine.nu - Lake Ylo - Finland (2:221/6.0)
  • From Alexander Koryagin@2:221/6 to Anton Shepelev on Mon Jun 24 16:13:54 2019
    Hi, Anton Shepelev!
    I read your message from 23.06.2019 23:24

    As sure as sugar is sweet, for none else but Kipling wrote it. I
    haven't read the original, but the Soviet animation is very clever
    and not children at all at all:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NL7PSeN3SYU
    (unfortunately no subtitles)

    Kipling's cat is male whereas its Russian couterpart female,
    probably because such cunning wisdom is here considered a feminine
    trait.

    Why the Russian counterpart is female? You can watch the cartoon on your URL and hear that the cat talked as a male cat.

    https://youtu.be/NL7PSeN3SYU?t=254

    PS:
    "Kipling's cat is male whereas its Russian counterpart IS female,"

    Bye, Anton!
    Alexander Koryagin
    english_tutor 2019

    ---
    * Origin: nntps://fidonews.mine.nu - Lake Ylo - Finland (2:221/6.0)
  • From Anton Shepelev@2:221/6 to Alexander Koryagin on Mon Jun 24 16:40:28 2019
    Alexander Koryagin:

    Kipling's cat is male whereas its Russian counterpart IS
    female

    I intentionally elided that second instance of "is", even as
    Fracis Bacon elided "maketh" in:

    Reading maketh a full man; conference a ready man; and
    writing an exact man.

    ---
    * Origin: nntps://fidonews.mine.nu - Lake Ylo - Finland (2:221/6.0)
  • From Alexander Koryagin@2:221/6 to Anton Shepelev on Tue Jun 25 09:47:34 2019
    Hi, Anton Shepelev!
    I read your message from 24.06.2019 16:40

    Kipling's cat is male whereas its Russian counterpart IS female

    I intentionally elided that second instance of "is", even as Fracis
    Bacon elided "maketh" in:

    Reading maketh a full man; conference a ready man; and writing an
    exact man.

    That guy probably liked speaking informally, too. ;-)

    Although, according to punctuation rules, the gaping comma should be used:

    "Reading maketh a full man; conference, a ready man; and writing, an
    exact man."

    So, your sentence should be like this:

    "Kipling's cat is male whereas its Russian counterpart, female."


    PS:
    BTW, what did he mean speaking "conference maketh a ready man"?

    Bye, Anton!
    Alexander Koryagin
    english_tutor 2019

    ---
    * Origin: nntps://fidonews.mine.nu - Lake Ylo - Finland (2:221/6.0)
  • From Anton Shepelev@2:221/6 to Alexander Koryagin on Tue Jun 25 12:13:04 2019
    Alexander Koryagin to Anton Shepelev:

    I intentionally elided that second instance of "is",
    even as Fracis Bacon elided "maketh" in:

    Reading maketh a full man; conference a ready man;
    and writing an exact man.

    That guy probably liked speaking informally, too. ;-)

    I disagree and consider this aphorism grammatically perfect.

    Although, according to punctuation rules, the gaping
    comma should be used:

    Reading maketh a full man; conference, a ready man;
    and writing, an exact man.

    Although or also? Neither seems right because the sentence
    so introduced seems to explain why you think Bacon's
    sentence informal. Your version does not sound fluent,
    requiring pauses at every comma.

    BTW, what did he mean speaking "conference maketh a
    ready man"?

    That live conversation requires, and therefore develops,
    quick reasoning.

    ---
    * Origin: nntps://fidonews.mine.nu - Lake Ylo - Finland (2:221/6.0)
  • From mark lewis@1:3634/12.73 to Alexander Koryagin on Tue Jun 25 11:55:00 2019
    On 2019 Jun 25 12:13:04, Anton Shepelev wrote to you:

    BTW, what did he mean speaking "conference maketh a ready man"?

    That live conversation requires, and therefore develops, quick reasoning.

    in other words, conferring... confer, conference...

    )\/(ark

    Always Mount a Scratch Monkey
    Do you manage your own servers? If you are not running an IDS/IPS yer doin' it wrong...
    ... Sexual repression causes most of the violence in the world today.
    ---
    * Origin: (1:3634/12.73)
  • From Ardith Hinton@1:153/716 to Alexander Koryagin on Mon Jul 8 16:30:10 2019
    Hi, Alexander! Recently you wrote in a message to Anton Shepelev:

    [...] according to punctuation rules, the gaping comma
    should be used:

    "Reading maketh a full man; conference, a ready man;
    and writing, an exact man."


    Hmm... nice theory, except that the sentence continues after "exact man" and Bacon uses a number of commas there (https://www.enotes.com).

    I understand where you're coming from because I encountered similar problems in my adventures with Latin & French. The textbook explains what we should do... and the concept seems logical until we get to question #4, which introduces an added wrinkle the authors didn't tell us about. :-))



    So, your sentence should be like this:

    "Kipling's cat is male whereas its Russian counterpart,
    female."


    In a short sentence like this I'd say:


    Kipling's cat is male; its Russian counterpart, female.

    or

    Kipling's cat is male, whereas its Russian counterpart is female.



    BTW, what did he mean speaking "conference maketh a
    ready man"?


    When all of us share our ideas in E_T the whole is greater than the sum of its parts. I learn as much from others as they do from me & I realize ... before you need to ask... why I may suggest you add a comma here or there even though it appears on the surface that I'm not taking my own advice. :-)




    --- timEd/386 1.10.y2k+
    * Origin: Wits' End, Vancouver CANADA (1:153/716)
  • From Alexander Koryagin@2:221/6 to Ardith Hinton on Tue Jul 9 09:37:08 2019
    Hi, Ardith Hinton!
    I read your message from 08.07.2019 16:30

    [...] according to punctuation rules, the gaping comma should be
    used:

    "Reading maketh a full man; conference, a ready man; and writing,
    an exact man."

    Hmm... nice theory, except that the sentence continues after "exact man"
    and Bacon uses a number of commas there (https://www.enotes.com).

    I haven't found there anything on this account.

    I understand where you're coming from because I encountered similar problems in my adventures with Latin & French. The textbook
    explains what we should do... and the concept seems logical until
    we get to question #4, which introduces an added wrinkle the
    authors didn't tell us about. :-))

    Yeah, ;) my comment was based on the textbook "Punctuation simplified and applied" by Gerald Woods.

    http://pics.propush.ru/img/omitwordscomma__jw5ae.jpg


    So, your sentence should be like this:

    "Kipling's cat is male whereas its Russian counterpart, female."


    In a short sentence like this I'd say:


    Kipling's cat is male; its Russian counterpart, female.

    or

    Kipling's cat is male, whereas its Russian counterpart is female.

    I like the last sentence the most. Indeed, the economy of ink is too small when
    we shorten it by just two letters. ;-)

    BTW, what did he mean speaking "conference maketh a ready man"?

    When all of us share our ideas in E_T the whole is greater than the
    sum of its parts. I learn as much from others as they do from me &
    I realize.. before you need to ask... why I may suggest you add a
    comma here or there even though it appears on the surface that I'm
    not taking my own advice. :-)

    It's interesting - if you had used "want" instead "suggest" would you add "to" before "add"?

    "I may want you TO add comma here".

    Bye, Ardith!
    Alexander Koryagin
    english_tutor 2019

    ---
    * Origin: nntps://fidonews.mine.nu - Lake Ylo - Finland (2:221/6.0)
  • From Anton Shepelev@2:221/6 to Alexander Koryagin on Wed Jul 10 01:28:56 2019
    Alexander Koryagin to Ardith Hinton:

    why I may suggest you add a comma here or there even
    though it appears on the surface that I'm not taking my
    own advice. :-)

    It's interesting -- if you had used "want" instead
    "suggest" would you add "to" before "add"?

    "I may want you TO add comma here".

    It depends on how you compose your sentence: with a
    dependent clause in the subjunctive or with an adverb:

    a. I want (that) he (shall) add a comma here.
    b. I want him to add a comma here.

    I used the thrid-person pronoun to make the case obvious:
    the nominative in a. and the objective in b. Optional words
    are in parentheses. You can't use `suggest' -- nor
    `recommend', for that matter -- in b:

    1. I recommended him to my friends, but
    2. I recommended that he read the book.

    ---
    * Origin: nntps://fidonews.mine.nu - Lake Ylo - Finland (2:221/6.0)
  • From Ardith Hinton@1:153/716 to Alexander Koryagin on Wed Jul 10 23:46:57 2019
    Hi, Alexander! Recently you wrote in a message to Ardith Hinton:

    [...] according to punctuation rules, the gaping comma
    should be used:

    "Reading maketh a full man; conference, a ready man;
    and writing, an exact man."

    Hmm... nice theory, except that the sentence continues
    after "exact man" and Bacon uses a number of commas there
    (https://www.enotes.com).

    I haven't found there anything on this account.


    Sorry... my mistake. That's where I found a useful analysis of the meaning by William Delaney, but not the complete sentence. What I had in mind was the expanded quotation I found at https://www.forbes.com/quotes/2933. :-)



    I realize.. before you need to ask... why I may suggest
    you add a comma here or there even though it appears on
    the surface that I'm not taking my own advice. :-)


    It's interesting - if you had used "want" instead
    |instead of

    "suggest" would you add "to" before "add"?


    "I may want you TO add comma here".


    From a strictly grammatical POV, it would be correct to say "I want you to add a comma here". With advanced students, however, I'm much more of a descriptivist. I reckon folks like you are capable of deciding for themselves what to do if they have enough information & I'll gladly contribute some. :-Q




    --- timEd/386 1.10.y2k+
    * Origin: Wits' End, Vancouver CANADA (1:153/716)