Some of the other usual "computer" echos seem empty/dead, so I thought I'd post
my question here - and it relates to a 9-year old matter, so it kinda fits in this echo. :)

Has anyone experienced lost of diminished retention of data on an old micro sd card?

In my case, the card is about 9 or 10 years old. 4 gb. I used it to offload copies of files that I didn't quite need to access too frequently anymore, but the storage to the microSD was convenient.

Now, 9-10 years later, some of the files do not seem to be accessible. Windows struggles to read certain files - and would often fail.

The card itself did *not* entertain frequent reads or writes. The last files that were stored on the card are dated 2012.

Many of the files were small, under 100kb each (html code samples, small photos
for website work, some pdf files, copies of bills, etc.) There were about 20 subdirectories, and a couple of the directories contained over 3000 files each.

I have been able to copy (save) about half the content. I can't delete *some* directories or files from the device anymore.

Is 10 years a normal lifespan of microSD cards? It is possible that unusually high temperature may have played a part in the matter (specifically, direct sunlight hitting the card over time)

Anyone with similar experience?

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August Abolins wrote to All <=-

Some of the other usual "computer" echos seem empty/dead, so I
thought I'd post my question here - and it relates to a 9-year old
matter, so it kinda fits in this echo. :)

Has anyone experienced lost of diminished retention of data on an
old micro sd card?

8<----- EDIT ----->B

I have been able to copy (save) about half the content. I can't
delete *some* directories or files from the device anymore.

Is 10 years a normal lifespan of microSD cards? It is possible that unusually high temperature may have played a part in the matter (specifically, direct sunlight hitting the card over time)

Anyone with similar experience?

I've no direct experience with degradation of SD cards - micro or std.

But, I've had lost data/corrupted data on nearly everything else. Heat,
bright light and cosmic rays seem to play some role. I've even had CDs
and DVDs get trashy parts on me.

Having been bitten more than once I've adopted a practice of copying "important" files onto a separate device/medium then use a file comparison utility to check the result.

IOW - trust your media - but always "cut the cards" by checking. It's
when yo're not looking that the data goes "walk-about".

... Amiga made it possible. Commodore made it dead.

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Hello August.

12 Sep 19 05:06, you wrote to All:

I'd responded to this message via QWK but I guess I killed off that reply packet by accident...

Has anyone experienced lost of diminished retention of data on an old micro sd card?

After about four years, the flash memory can become unstable due to low voltage
retention. Also, rememember that flash memory of any type has a finite number of R/W cycles. Using any type of flash memory for long-term storage is a bad idea. I'd put it on something more permanent such as CD/DVD though all media types are subject to failures of different type.

You're on-topic here. I know the moderator.

Later,
Sean

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In a post between "Sean Dennis : August Abolins", on 9/13/2019 4:40 AM

..Also, rememember that flash memory of any type has a
finite number of R/W cycles. Using any type of flash memory for
long-term storage is a bad idea. I'd put it on something more permanent
such as CD/DVD though all media types are subject to failures of
different type.

So.. I guess you would not be a fan of replacing spinning HDDs with SSDs?

I was contemplating of having my next pc upgrade to have a main 1TB SSD. Now, I am not sure what to think. :(

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In a post between "Dave Drum : August Abolins", on 9/12/2019 3:49 AM

I've no direct experience with degradation of SD cards - micro or std.

But, I've had lost data/corrupted data on nearly everything else. Heat, bright light and cosmic rays seem to play some role. I've even had CDs
and DVDs get trashy parts on me.

Are those your own burned CDs or DVDs? My commercial CD collection from when I first started buying those things in the 80s, still play beautifully.

Having been bitten more than once I've adopted a practice of copying "important" files onto a separate device/medium then use a file comparison utility to check the result.

copy /v ..very handy.

But doesn't the traditional gui drag-drop process automatically do a verify?

.. Amiga made it possible. Commodore made it dead.

Which reminds me, I have a wonderful Commodore calculator, SR-9190R. I got it at a Consumer's Distibuting in the late 70's for about $50, new. It essentially replaced my $400+ Texas Instruments programmable calculator just a few short years prior to that. But the Commodore has the best keys and is the only one that still works!

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On 09-21-19 03:48, August Abolins wrote to Dave Drum <=-

Are those your own burned CDs or DVDs? My commercial CD collection
from when I first started buying those things in the 80s, still play beautifully.

CDs, I haven't had issues with, but a lot of store bought DVDs have failed over the past 10 years. They have no visible defects, and cleaning them generally doesn't help. :(


... Honk if you love peace and quiet!
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August Abolins wrote to Dave Drum <=-

In a post between "Dave Drum : August Abolins", on 9/12/2019 3:49 AM

I've no direct experience with degradation of SD cards - micro or std.

But, I've had lost data/corrupted data on nearly everything else. Heat, bright light and cosmic rays seem to play some role. I've even had CDs
and DVDs get trashy parts on me.

Are those your own burned CDs or DVDs? My commercial CD collection
from when I first started buying those things in the 80s, still play beautifully.

Both - more so with the early Dave-made stuff. The later examples, done
with a much better writer have had less problems but still are nowhere
near perfect. And some of the "factory" optical media have developed
garbles and drop-outs.

Having been bitten more than once I've adopted a practice of copying "important" files onto a separate device/medium then use a file comparison utility to check the result.

copy /v ..very handy.

But doesn't the traditional gui drag-drop process automatically do a verify?

Sorta-kinda but this is Microsnot we're talking about here. I use a nice freebie called "Winmerge" downloaded from Source Forge.

.. Amiga made it possible. Commodore made it dead.

Which reminds me, I have a wonderful Commodore calculator, SR-9190R. I got it at a Consumer's Distibuting in the late 70's for about $50,
new. It essentially replaced my $400+ Texas Instruments programmable calculator just a few short years prior to that. But the Commodore
has the best keys and is the only one that still works!

My only Commode Door calculator is the little "stocking stuffer"/novelty
that looked like a 3.5" disk and was solar powered. I sold as many of
those as I could get my hands on (less the one I still have) when I had
my confuser store.

... MS-DOS=suit & tie, Macintosh=cool shades, Amiga=high heels & leather

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On 21/09/2019 2:15 a.m., Tony Langdon : August Abolins wrote:>

On 09-21-19 03:48, August Abolins wrote to Dave Drum <=-

Are those your own burned CDs or DVDs? My commercial CD
collection from when I first started buying those things
in the 80s, still play beautifully.

CDs, I haven't had issues with, but a lot of store bought DVDs have
failed over the past 10 years. They have no visible defects, and
cleaning them generally doesn't help. :(

Have you tried the same DVDs on a newer machine? An older machine could start developing problems tracking, among other things too.

I have an older LG player (with a hdd for recording) and it can take its time to cue up a commercial DVD, and sometimes fail. A retry by opening and closing
the tray will make it "kick in". But the same discs cue and work flawlessly in
a Bluray capable player.

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On 09-22-19 21:34, August Abolins wrote to Tony Langdon <=-

Have you tried the same DVDs on a newer machine? An older machine
could start developing problems tracking, among other things too.

Yes - multiple machines, same result, whether a Blu-ray or a newish computer DVD drive.


... Relax. It's only ones and zeroes.
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On 22/09/2019 9:08 p.m., Tony Langdon : August Abolins wrote:

 AA> Have you tried the same DVDs on a newer machine?  An older machine
 AA> could start developing problems tracking, among other things too.

Yes - multiple machines, same result, whether a Blu-ray or a newish
computer DVD drive.

Did the disc ever get exposed to extreme changes in the temperature and moisture? Apparently the edges of those discs expose the recorded layer. Humidity would be a killer.

Also.. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disc_rot ..is interesting.

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-=> On 09-23-19 18:07, August Abolins wrote to Tony Langdon <=-

On 22/09/2019 9:08 p.m., Tony Langdon : August Abolins wrote:

 AA> Have you tried the same DVDs on a newer machine?  An older machine
 AA> could start developing problems tracking, among other things too.

Yes - multiple machines, same result, whether a Blu-ray or a newish
computer DVD drive.

Did the disc ever get exposed to extreme changes in the temperature and moisture? Apparently the edges of those discs expose the recorded
layer. Humidity would be a killer.

No, they live inside, and humidity here is low much of the year.


... Real Sysops read the documentation; or at least skim them
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Sat 6-Feb-2021 23:13

what computer system are you using?

You're replying to a six-month old message. I don't remember this. :)

I am running two bbs systems my time is limited to doing other things.


Phil
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