• Study Suggests There Are 300 Million

    From Charles Pierson@2:240/1120.976 to All on Wed Nov 11 08:13:40 2020
    Hello, All.


    Study Suggests There Are 300 Million Potentially Habitable Worlds in Our Galaxy

    November 9, 2020



    By Tim Binnall

    An exhaustive new study from NASA has concluded that there could be a whopping 300 million habitable worlds in the Milky Way galaxy. The intriguing determination reportedly came by way of a two-year-long project in which 44 astronomers studied data collected by the Kepler Telescope. Seen as the culmination of that exoplanet-hunting spacecraft's work, one of the scientists on the team marveled to the New York Times that "this is the science result we've all been waiting for" and "the reason that Kepler was selected for flight in December 2001."

    Specifically, the team combed through the voluminous Kepler data and found that "half the stars similar in temperature to our Sun could have a rocky planet capable of supporting liquid water on its surface." Taking into account insights gleaned from the European Space Agency's Gaia mission, which looked at the type of energy emitted from these stars and how it is absorbed by the planets that orbit them, they ultimately came to the figure of 300 million potentially habitable exoplanets in our galaxy based on "the most conservative estimate that 7% of Sun-like stars host such worlds." Considering that is a cautious guess, scientists say, the true number of such exoplanets could be significantly higher.

    While that enormous number should give optimism to those hoping to eventually find some kind of intelligent life out there in space, some researchers cautioned that one might wish to temper their expectations. That's because scientists have yet to identify an exoplanet which is the same size as Earth and possesses a matching orbit around a Sun-like star, which are, as of yet, the only conditions known to produce life. Be that as it may, it stands to reason that there ought to be at least one such world among the 300 million theoretically habitable exoplanets in our galaxy. How long it may take us to find it, of course, remains to be seen.


    ...

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    Best regards!
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    * Origin: Houston, TX (2:240/1120.976)
  • From Wilfred van Velzen@2:280/464 to Charles Pierson on Wed Nov 11 15:52:26 2020
    Hi Charles,

    On 2020-11-11 08:13:40, you wrote to All:

    Study Suggests There Are 300 Million Potentially Habitable Worlds in
    Our Galaxy

    Interesting of course...

    SEEN-BY: 203/0 221/1 240/1120 1634 1895 8002 8005 280/464 5003 5006 335/364
    SEEN-BY: 2432/390
    @PATH: 240/1120 280/5003 464

    This is the first message I ever got in this area, didn't even know I was connected to it. ;-)

    What made you post in this area instead of 'ASTRONOMY' ?

    Bye, Wilfred.

    --- FMail-lnx64 2.1.0.18-B20170815
    * Origin: FMail development HQ (2:280/464)
  • From Charles Pierson@2:240/1120.976 to Wilfred van Velzen on Wed Nov 11 09:39:30 2020
    Hello, Wilfred van Velzen.
    On 11/11/20 3:52 PM you wrote:

    Hi Charles, On 2020-11-11 08:13:40, you wrote to All:
    Study Suggests There Are 300 Million Potentially Habitable Worlds
    in Our Galaxy
    Interesting of course...
    SEEN-BY: 203/0 221/1 240/1120 1634 1895 8002 8005 280/464 5003
    5006 335/364 SEEN-BY: 2432/390 @PATH: 240/1120 280/5003 464
    This is the first message I ever got in this area, didn't even
    know I was connected to it. ;-) What made you post in this area
    instead of 'ASTRONOMY' ?

    Honestly, morbid curiosity. I like seeing which areas will actually get a reply.

    I probably would have posted it in ASTRONOMY as well, if I knew how to cross post with this program. I think it only has Forward to a different area.

    Bye, Wilfred. --- FMail-lnx64 2.1.0.18-B20170815 * Origin: FMail development HQ (2:280/464)

    --
    Best regards!
    Posted using Hotdoged on Android
    --- Hotdoged/2.13.5/Android
    * Origin: Houston, TX (2:240/1120.976)
  • From Wilfred van Velzen@2:280/464 to Charles Pierson on Wed Nov 11 17:30:00 2020
    Hi Charles,

    On 2020-11-11 09:39:30, you wrote to me:

    This is the first message I ever got in this area, didn't even
    know I was connected to it. ;-) What made you post in this area
    instead of 'ASTRONOMY' ?

    Honestly, morbid curiosity. I like seeing which areas will actually get a reply.

    I'm going to connect it on my other links that have it available. Maybe that will release some isolated "sub nets" of the area. ;-)

    Bye, Wilfred.

    --- FMail-lnx64 2.1.0.18-B20170815
    * Origin: FMail development HQ (2:280/464)
  • From August Abolins@1:153/757.2 to Charles Pierson on Sun Dec 6 10:13:31 2020
    An exhaustive new study from NASA has concluded that there could be a whopping 300 million habitable worlds in the Milky Way galaxy..

    I can just picture these scientists "exhausted" and slumped over their desks.

    :)

    I am not entirely impressed by the study. Is it really any different than saying "with enough monkeys, they could write Shakespeare".
    --- SBBSecho 3.11-Linux
    * Origin: The Rusty MailBox - Penticton, BC Canada (1:153/757.2)
  • From Charles Pierson@1:153/757.26 to August Abolins on Sun Dec 6 19:04:10 2020
    On 06 Dec 2020, August Abolins said the following...
    I can just picture these scientists "exhausted" and slumped over their desks.

    Studying is very tiring.
    I am not entirely impressed by the study. Is it really any different than saying "with enough monkeys, they could write Shakespeare".

    It's theoretical, sure. But at this point in time, speculation and theorizing is the best we have.

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A46 2020/08/26 (Raspberry Pi/32)
    * Origin: theoasisbbs.ddns.net:1357 (1:153/757.26)
  • From August Abolins@2:221/6 to Wilfred van Velzen on Tue Dec 15 14:52:32 2020
    On 11/11/2020 10:30 AM, between "Wilfred van Velzen - Charles Pierson":

    This is the first message I ever got in this area, didn't even
    know I was connected to it. ;-) What made you post in this area
    instead of 'ASTRONOMY' ?

    Honestly, morbid curiosity. I like seeing which areas will actually get a
    reply.

    I'm going to connect it on my other links that have it available.
    Maybe that will release some isolated "sub nets" of the area. ;-)

    But it is not getting attention. It's not in Janice's echolist table in the Fidogazette.

    This is probably one of the reasons why new people are not finding Fidonet echos.

    It would be nice if there was a more consolidated (and real-time) way to announce active/live echos.

    ---
    * Origin: nntp://news.fidonet.fi (2:221/6.0)
  • From Charles Pierson@1:153/757.26 to August Abolins on Tue Dec 15 13:23:08 2020
    On 15 Dec 2020, August Abolins said the following...

    On 11/11/2020 10:30 AM, between "Wilfred van Velzen - Charles Pierson":

    This is the first message I ever got in this area, didn't even
    know I was connected to it. ;-) What made you post in this area
    instead of 'ASTRONOMY' ?

    Honestly, morbid curiosity. I like seeing which areas will actuall

    a
    reply.

    I'm going to connect it on my other links that have it available.
    Maybe that will release some isolated "sub nets" of the area. ;-)

    But it is not getting attention. It's not in Janice's echolist table in the Fidogazette.

    There are many, many echos that aren't listed. That doesn't mean they aren'tt connected though.
    This is probably one of the reasons why new people are not finding
    Fidonet echos.

    Echos are limited by whatever the Sysop carries. I've read discussions about
    it where some sysops have said they only carry those areas which interest
    them. That's fair, it's their system after all. So it becomes a crap shoot whether or not a particular Echo is on a particular system.
    It would be nice if there was a more consolidated (and real-time) way to announce active/live echos.


    You aren't going to get real-time with FTN Technology. The best you'lll get
    is those systems that have bots or whatever that post stats from their
    systems.

    But I'm sure there are many "abandoned" echos such as this one that are stilk on various systems. you have to muddle through and find them, and see which ones still are linked to multiple systems, and if you want, you can get them relisted as "official" echos on the ELIST.

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A46 2020/08/26 (Raspberry Pi/32)
    * Origin: theoasisbbs.ddns.net:1357 (1:153/757.26)
  • From Wilfred van Velzen@2:280/464 to August Abolins on Tue Dec 15 17:09:24 2020
    Hi August,

    On 2020-12-15 14:52:32, you wrote to me:

    I'm going to connect it on my other links that have it available.
    Maybe that will release some isolated "sub nets" of the area. ;-)

    But it is not getting attention. It's not in Janice's echolist table in the
    Fidogazette.

    I never look at it. ;)

    If I want to look for (active) areas, I look in the 'STATS' echomail area. All those dead areas, are best left that way! ;)

    This is probably one of the reasons why new people are not finding
    Fidonet echos.

    The best way, still, to find areas for points and nodes, is to send a %LIST to their links. So you get the existing ones on their systems. (Not necessarily the active ones)
    BBS users of course can only access what is available on the system they are logged in to at the moment...

    It would be nice if there was a more consolidated (and real-time) way
    to announce active/live echos.

    The 'STATS' area? But not many systems announce activity their. But still since a few major mail movers do, you can get a good impression.

    Bye, Wilfred.

    --- FMail-lnx64 2.1.0.18-B20170815
    * Origin: FMail development HQ (2:280/464)
  • From Wilfred van Velzen@2:280/464 to Charles Pierson on Tue Dec 15 17:15:31 2020
    Hi Charles,

    On 2020-12-15 13:23:08, you wrote to August Abolins:

    Echos are limited by whatever the Sysop carries. I've read discussions about it where some sysops have said they only carry those areas which interest them. That's fair, it's their system after all. So it becomes a crap shoot whether or not a particular Echo is on a particular system.

    I used to connect only to areas, that (at least mildly) interest me. I never do send %ALL to AreaFix of my links. I don't need links to all those hundreds of long forgotten dead areas that some systems keep in their config.

    But I'm sure there are many "abandoned" echos such as this one that
    are stilk on various systems. you have to muddle through and find
    them, and see which ones still are linked to multiple systems,

    Why do we need this area anyway? Since there already is ASTRONOMY, which at least had a bit of traffic over the years.

    and if you want, you can get them relisted as "official" echos on the ELIST.

    There is nothing official about the ELIST! ;)

    SEEN-BY: 124/5016 153/757 203/0 221/0 1 6 240/1120 1634 1895 8002 8005 SEEN-BY: 280/464 5003 5006 331/313 335/364 423/120 712/848 2432/390 SEEN-BY: 2452/250 4500/1
    @PATH: 153/757 221/6 335/364 240/1120 280/5003 464

    This is getting bigger though...

    Bye, Wilfred.

    --- FMail-lnx64 2.1.0.18-B20170815
    * Origin: FMail development HQ (2:280/464)
  • From Charles Pierson@1:153/757.26 to Wilfred van Velzen on Tue Dec 15 17:22:35 2020
    On 15 Dec 2020, Wilfred van Velzen said the following...
    I used to connect only to areas, that (at least mildly) interest me. I never do
    send %ALL to AreaFix of my links. I don't need links to all those
    hundreds of long forgotten dead areas that some systems keep in their config.

    As a Sysop, that's completely within your rights. I would guess Hubs are the only systems that would need to carry everything, although I believe it's possiible to handle transfer of echos without carrying them on your system.

    Why do we need this area anyway? Since there already is ASTRONOMY, which at least had a bit of traffic over the years.

    Maybe we don't. It could be that these two echos handled different in times gone by. Maybe one was strictly announcements and the other had discussions. The problem is that once an echo is created, it exists forever, unless
    somehow every system that carries it deletes it.

    and if you want, you can get them relisted as "official" echos on the ELIST.

    There is nothing official about the ELIST! ;)


    Notice I put "official" in quotes. I suppose I could have said listed on the backbone, but that's only Z1 right?

    SEEN-BY: 124/5016 153/757 203/0 221/0 1 6 240/1120 1634 1895 8002 800 SEEN-BY: 280/464 5003 5006 331/313 335/364 423/120 712/848 2432/390 SEEN-BY: 2452/250 4500/1
    @PATH: 153/757 221/6 335/364 240/1120 280/5003 464

    This is getting bigger though...


    So it's being seen, if not used.

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A46 2020/08/26 (Raspberry Pi/32)
    * Origin: theoasisbbs.ddns.net:1357 (1:153/757.26)
  • From August Abolins@1:153/757.2 to Wilfred van Velzen on Tue Dec 15 11:52:33 2020

    But I'm sure there are many "abandoned" echos such as this one that
    are stilk on various systems. you have to muddle through and find
    them, and see which ones still are linked to multiple systems,

    Why do we need this area anyway? Since there already is ASTRONOMY, which at least had a bit of traffic over the years.

    I concur. ASTRONOMY is probably "godd enough".


    and if you want, you can get them relisted as "official" echos on the ELIST.

    There is nothing official about the ELIST! ;)

    At least ELIST is a good standard of organizing and announcing the availability of echos. Without it, sysops are generally do a piss poor job of advertising and informing users.


    SEEN-BY: 124/5016 153/757 203/0 221/0 1 6 240/1120 1634 1895 8002 8005 SEEN-BY: 280/464 5003 5006 331/313 335/364 423/120 712/848 2432/390 SEEN-BY: 2452/250 4500/1
    @PATH: 153/757 221/6 335/364 240/1120 280/5003 464

    This is getting bigger though...

    Is it bigger than ASTRONOMY's? Does the SEEN-BY include pass-through systems? --- SBBSecho 3.11-Linux
    * Origin: The Rusty MailBox - Penticton, BC Canada (1:153/757.2)
  • From Wilfred van Velzen@2:280/464 to Charles Pierson on Tue Dec 15 21:00:26 2020
    Hi Charles,

    On 2020-12-15 17:22:35, you wrote to me:

    I used to connect only to areas, that (at least mildly) interest me.
    I never do send %ALL to AreaFix of my links. I don't need links to
    all those hundreds of long forgotten dead areas that some systems
    keep in their config.

    As a Sysop, that's completely within your rights. I would guess Hubs are the only systems that would need to carry everything,

    There are no official echomail hubs in fidonet, that need to do anything, afaik. Echomail is all voluntary.

    although I believe it's possiible to handle transfer of echos without carrying them on your system.

    You can configure areas passthrough. So no messages in that area are stored in your local messagebase. But still you need to connect to them and configure them. So somehow they are somewhat on your system, "costing" effort and resources.

    Why do we need this area anyway? Since there already is ASTRONOMY,
    which at least had a bit of traffic over the years.

    Maybe we don't. It could be that these two echos handled different in times
    gone by. Maybe one was strictly announcements and the other had discussions.

    Could be. Although I think there is an other kind of distinction. ASTRONOMY being more the scientific area, and ASTRONET sounds more non scientific...

    The problem is that once an echo is created, it exists forever, unless somehow every system that carries it deletes it.

    Indeed. And deleting everywhere never happens. It takes a very long time for dead or abondoned echos to disappear, and some never did. Some even get some live back in them at one point, like this one. ;)

    and if you want, you can get them relisted as "official" echos
    on
    the
    ELIST.

    There is nothing official about the ELIST! ;)


    Notice I put "official" in quotes.

    I noticed! ;)

    But I still needed to make the remark! ;)

    I suppose I could have said listed on the backbone, but that's only Z1 right?

    It's only 3 systems connected to each other, which have a level of organisation and administration for a particular set of areas. ;)

    SEEN-BY: 124/5016 153/757 203/0 221/0 1 6 240/1120 1634 1895
    8002
    800
    SEEN-BY: 280/464 5003 5006 331/313 335/364 423/120 712/848
    2432/390
    SEEN-BY: 2452/250 4500/1
    @PATH: 153/757 221/6 335/364 240/1120 280/5003 464

    This is getting bigger though...

    So it's being seen, if not used.

    It's being spread around...

    Bye, Wilfred.

    --- FMail-lnx64 2.1.0.18-B20170815
    * Origin: FMail development HQ (2:280/464)
  • From August Abolins@2:221/6 to Charles Pierson on Wed Dec 16 03:32:28 2020
    On 12/15/2020 6:23 AM, between "Charles Pierson - August Abolins":

    There are many, many echos that aren't listed. That doesn't mean they aren'tt connected though.

    Of course. That is part of the problem - they are not easily "known" to exist.


    Echos are limited by whatever the Sysop carries. I've read discussions about it where some sysops have said they only carry those areas which interest them. That's fair, it's their system after all. So it becomes a crap shoot whether or not a particular Echo is on a particular system.

    Crap shoot it certainly is. :( But that situation does not help to bolster users.

    It's no good for example to have 3 different BBSes to boast that they carry Fidonet, when all 3 of them carry different combinations and/or only a handful of echos and never plan to change.


    It would be nice if there was a more consolidated (and real-time) way to announce active/live echos.

    You aren't going to get real-time with FTN Technology. The best you'lll get is those systems that have bots or whatever that post stats from their systems.

    If "bot" is the closest to real-time, that would be great!

    Perhaps a dedicated echo that serves to allow different BBSes to advertise their echo lists could work?


    But I'm sure there are many "abandoned" echos such as this one that are stilk on various systems. you have to muddle through and find them, and see which ones still are linked to multiple systems, and if you want, you can get them relisted as "official" echos on the ELIST.

    Who is the "official" moderator of this one?

    ---
    * Origin: nntp://news.fidonet.fi (2:221/6.0)
  • From August Abolins@2:221/6 to Wilfred van Velzen on Wed Dec 16 03:52:40 2020
    On 12/15/2020 2:00 PM, between "Wilfred van Velzen - Charles Pierson":


    Why do we need this area anyway? Since there already is ASTRONOMY,
    which at least had a bit of traffic over the years.

    Maybe we don't. It could be that these two echos handled different in times
    gone by. Maybe one was strictly announcements and the other had discussions.

    Could be. Although I think there is an other kind of distinction.
    ASTRONOMY being more the scientific area, and ASTRONET sounds more
    non scientific...

    To me ASTRONET sounds more encompassing - as in "NETting" in. So, it could be anything with ASTR/O as a prefix: astral projections, astrolabs, astrodomes, astrophysics, etc..

    The problem is that once an echo is created, it exists forever, unless somehow every system that carries it deletes it.

    Indeed. And deleting everywhere never happens. It takes a very long
    time for dead or abondoned echos to disappear, and some never did.
    Some even get some live back in them at one point, like this one. ;)

    Perhaps sysops can be encouraged to take stock of their echos at least once a year and drop the dead ones. Couldn't the EC encourage that as part of standard operations?

    ---
    * Origin: nntp://news.fidonet.fi (2:221/6.0)
  • From August Abolins@2:221/6 to Wilfred van Velzen on Wed Dec 16 04:16:02 2020
    On 12/15/2020 10:09 AM, between "Wilfred van Velzen - August Abolins":

    But it is not getting attention. It's not in Janice's echolist table in the
    Fidogazette.

    I never look at it. ;)

    You don't have to look at the whole mag. Just take a look at the sorted echo table. I think it is one of the best summaries of active fidonet echos that there is that a USER can understand. The other STATS tables are just too overly statistical and become pedantic.


    If I want to look for (active) areas, I look in the 'STATS' echomail
    area. All those dead areas, are best left that way! ;)

    OK. Took a look. Pharcyde, diskshop, CRBBS and a couple others do a nice regular report. But the Top-10 should should extended to the top 20 or so.

    The USER needs to know what the possibilities are. If there is an echo excluded from the top 10, then that unreported echo will remain dead.


    This is probably one of the reasons why new people are not finding Fidonet echos.

    The best way, still, to find areas for points and nodes, is to send a
    %LIST to their links. So you get the existing ones on their systems.
    (Not necessarily the active ones) BBS users of course can only access
    what is available on the system they are logged in to at the
    moment...


    %LIST is only good from a point user or another sysop that have established passwords to talk to areafix. I'm talking about something that a user coming onboard to fidonet or anothernet could use.


    It would be nice if there was a more consolidated (and real-time) way
    to announce active/live echos.

    The 'STATS' area? But not many systems announce activity their. But
    still since a few major mail movers do, you can get a good
    impression.

    I don't see the potential USER pouring through the different tables to figure out what echotag resembles what they are looking for.

    I think that sysops who have become so focused on their automation and interbbs connectivity have simply forgotten what it is like for a USER to find anything.

    Some time ago, I posted in FUTURE4FIDO about having a table that lists the top BBSs that carry specific echos:

    System 1 System 2 System 3 System 4
    TAGNAME1 BBS A BBS B BBS D BBS E
    TAGNAME2 BBS A BBS D BBS E BBS F
    TAGNAME3 BBS G BBS A BBS B BBS F

    THAT, would be useful for a user trying find an active echo that they could participate in and find the BBS to patronize.

    But I digress.. this thread is starting to feel like an ASTRO-echo experience, ;), and best revisited in FUTURE4FIDO.

    ---
    * Origin: nntp://news.fidonet.fi (2:221/6.0)
  • From Wilfred van Velzen@2:280/464 to August Abolins on Wed Dec 16 11:00:08 2020
    Hi August,

    On 2020-12-16 03:32:28, you wrote to Charles Pierson:

    Who is the "official" moderator of this one?

    I found something in an old elist:

    ASTRONET
    Astronomy Echo
    Observational Astronomy Echo.
    Status: Active
    Origin: Group:
    Distribution:
    Gateways:
    Language:
    # Nodes: N/A Volume: N/A Rules:
    Flags:
    Notes:
    Moderators: Mark Kaye, 1:249/109, mark.kaye@sympatico.ca
    Arnold Gill, 1:153/6.5
    Bill McCauley, 1:161/42
    Last changed: 2-Jun-2000 by mark.kaye@sympatico.ca, 1:261/1551, mark.kaye@sympatico.ca

    ASTRONOMY
    Astronomy Echo
    Astronomical observing and astrophysical discussion echo.
    Status: Active
    Origin: Group:
    Distribution:
    Gateways:
    Language:
    # Nodes: N/A Volume: N/A Rules:
    Flags:
    Notes:
    Moderators: Mark Kaye, 1:249/109, mark.kaye@sympatico.ca
    Arnold Gill, 1:153/6.5
    Bill McCauley, 1:161/42
    Last changed: 2-Jun-2000 by mark.kaye@sympatico.ca, 1:261/1551, mark.kaye@sympatico.ca


    I think, those moderators are long gone. They are no longer in the nodelist. And not much difference in the topics between the two.


    Bye, Wilfred.

    --- FMail-lnx64 2.1.0.18-B20170815
    * Origin: FMail development HQ (2:280/464)
  • From Wilfred van Velzen@2:280/464 to August Abolins on Wed Dec 16 11:07:32 2020
    Hi August,

    On 2020-12-16 03:52:40, you wrote to me:

    Could be. Although I think there is an other kind of distinction.
    ASTRONOMY being more the scientific area, and ASTRONET sounds more
    non scientific...

    To me ASTRONET sounds more encompassing - as in "NETting" in. So, it could
    be anything with ASTR/O as a prefix: astral projections, astrolabs, astrodomes, astrophysics, etc..

    See my previous message for what the moderators thought about it's subject...

    Indeed. And deleting everywhere never happens. It takes a very long
    time for dead or abondoned echos to disappear, and some never did.
    Some even get some live back in them at one point, like this one. ;)

    Perhaps sysops can be encouraged to take stock of their echos at least once
    a year and drop the dead ones.

    That would be nice but unrealistic. If even cleaning up the deadwood in the nodelist by the *C's seems impossible.

    Couldn't the EC encourage that as part of standard operations?

    EC's? Have you noticed any activity of any EC in the last decade?

    Bye, Wilfred.

    --- FMail-lnx64 2.1.0.18-B20170815
    * Origin: FMail development HQ (2:280/464)