On Jun 05, 2016 11:03am, Richard Menedetter wrote to Allen Prunty:

Please stop posting this misleading information here!

You are not the moderator of this echo, stop pretending to be one!

It hasn't been relevant to you or anyone else since November 2015 so why is it now? The echo was effectively Dead... now it's an issue now that someone wants to restart and get this going. A derelict ship found floating at sea can be salvaged by whomever comes upon it. This echo was floating dead in cyberspace now that someone wants to revive it why are you up in arms about it. Not one thing was being done to sustain and continue this echo and now it's an issue when someone attempts to salvage a derelict.

It has hit me like a load of bricks to find out that Asha has passed away. She was a very dear friend of mine back in the day. I was contacting her AMiga group to see what we can do to get this going again. The Amiga Society of Kentucky (ASK) is still alive and well.

I know -very- well the history of the echo as I was there in the early 1990s when it was formed. BY echopol1 there is no moderator here, there was no "host" system there were no rules posted. Since this is an "international" issue at this point according to echopol1 this echo has to be declared an international echo. Since there is no IC sitting currently and there isn't any records other than the past two moderators being Zone 1, the jurisdiction according to the ECHOPOL1 falls within the Zone one Echomail Coordinator who recognizes the ELIST. This echo was unowned, informal, ad-hoc at best. No rules have been posted in a very long time... I have messages dating back to 2011 and they are VERY few... no one has ever mention moderatorship at all.

If you want this to be declared an international echo then we need to seat an IC... legitimize this as an international echo, as we have plenty of past records in Zone1 (because we have an echolist... what record repository do you have in Zone2) and follow all your steps as outlined in ECHOPOL1 to bring it to your standards. Or we can handle it the way that it's been handled in Zone1 since the creation of the Amiga echo.

You have two choices, you can stay along for the ride and try to be constructive, building up the Amiga echo... and honoring Asha's memory (if you even knew or remembered her) or you can simply disconnect from the echo and start your own Zone2 Amiga echo, which is senseless. We are far much stronger together than separate. I believe strongly that when push comes to shove we are all here because of the Commodore Amiga now who is the moderator.

All you are going to do right now is cause discord in the echo, chase away the fresh blood that I am working at bringing (and old faces I am contacting to bring back) to the echo.

If you want to oust me then you will need to go appeal to a non-existant IC and get it declared international then go from there. Please take any further comments to Netmail.

I've booted my old Amiga 1200, it still works, and I'm going to be onlineing over 2 GB of Amiga files in the coming weeks. I have many DVD-ROMS burned of the old LiveWire BBS's filebase that were not destroyed in my house fire years ago. Luckily they were in a safe at a family member's house off site. I do hope that you will participate and enjoy what I am trying to do for all of us.

Allen

/\llen

... Duct tape is like the Force. It has light and dark sides, and it holds the universe together.
--- Platinum Xpress/Win/WINServer v3.0pr5
* Origin: Derby City LiveWire - Louisville, KY - livewirebbs.dy (1:2320/100)

Hi,

On 2016-06-05 12:15:04, Allen Prunty wrote to :
about: "Revival of the AMIGA Echo":

It hasn't been relevant to you or anyone else since November 2015 so
why is it now? The echo was effectively Dead... now it's an issue now that someone wants to restart and get this going.

That's not the issue. The issue is you hi-jacking the area, and claiming to be the moderator, without even consulting the area first.
There's nothing stoping you to "get it going" without being the moderator.

All you are going to do right now is cause discord in the echo, chase
away the fresh blood that I am working at bringing (and old faces I am contacting to bring back) to the echo.

You got it backwards. You started the discord with your actions.

Bye, Wilfred.


--- FMail-W32 1.69.22.178-B20160331
* Origin: Native IPv6 connectable node (2:280/464)

Hi Allen!

05 Jun 2016 12:15, from Allen Prunty -> :

Please stop posting this misleading information here!
You are not the moderator of this echo, stop pretending to be one!

It hasn't been relevant to you or anyone else since November 2015 so
why is it now?

It was and is relevant to me and others.

The fact that there was no message flow does not mean that we do not care!

You would have found this out if you would have written a message here before hijacking it!!

now it's an issue now that someone wants to restart and get this
going.

No issue at all if you want to contribute and write here.
No need to hijack the echo for that!!!!

now that someone wants to revive it why are you up in arms about it.

I have no problem with reviving.
Start contributing and writing here.

My problem is that you hijack it!

Not one thing was being done to sustain and continue this echo and now it's an issue when someone attempts to salvage a derelict.

Indeed.
Your analysis is correct.
And not everybody agrees with your definition of a dead echo.

I was contacting her AMiga group to see what we can do to get this
going again.

But you forgot to ask here if the participants of the echo are OK with it.

You have two choices, you can stay along for the ride and try to be constructive,

I just wanted to suggest something similar to you.

You can start contributing or go away!

You can also initiate a moderator election here.
What you cannot do is simply hijack the echo!

All you are going to do right now is cause discord in the echo, chase
away the fresh blood that I am working at bringing (and old faces I am contacting to bring back) to the echo.

Why do you need to hijack the echo in order to bring new blood.

New blood is very welcome here!
Just bring them here, no need for echo hijacking!

If you want to oust me then you will need to go appeal to a
non-existant IC and get it declared international then go from there. Please take any further comments to Netmail.

As soon as you take you "rule" postings to netmail addressed to /dev/null.

I've booted my old Amiga 1200, it still works

Same here.
The only difference my amiga is not that old.
I bought it 10 years ago ... did not have one in the day.

Works nicely with a new 128MB accelerator card and a 8GB CF card.

CU, Ricsi

--- GoldED+/LNX
* Origin: Point not found. A)bort, R)eread, I)gnore (2:310/31)

Hello Allen,
In a message dated 05 Jun 16 you wrote to :

[skip]

I do hope that you will participate
and enjoy what I am trying to do for all of us.

Thank you!

WBR, Alex Kovrigin <alex(at)kovrigin.ru>

--- Mail Manager 1.22x/n #1509
* Origin: Mail Manager, The Last Frontier! (2:5000/111.47@fidonet)

05 Jun 16 18:54, you wrote to Allen Prunty:

It hasn't been relevant to you or anyone else since November 2015 so
why is it now? The echo was effectively Dead... now it's an issue
now that someone wants to restart and get this going.

That's not the issue. The issue is you hi-jacking the area, and
claiming to be the moderator, without even consulting the area first. There's nothing stoping you to "get it going" without being the
moderator.

how can you hijack something that didn't exist until allen came along and started posting???

All you are going to do right now is cause discord in the echo, chase
away the fresh blood that I am working at bringing (and old faces I
am contacting to bring back) to the echo.

You got it backwards. You started the discord with your actions.

you've got it backwards with the cart before the horse...

)\/(ark

Always Mount a Scratch Monkey

... We don't care how they do it in New York.
---
* Origin: (1:3634/12.73)

Wilfred van Velzen wrote to Allen Prunty <=-

It hasn't been relevant to you or anyone else since November 2015 so
why is it now? The echo was effectively Dead... now it's an issue now that someone wants to restart and get this going.

That's not the issue. The issue is you hi-jacking the area, and
claiming to be the moderator, without even consulting the area first. There's nothing stoping you to "get it going" without being the moderator.

Who was to consult. There has been no traffic in here for the better part of a year. So, siddown and sharrop.

All you are going to do right now is cause discord in the echo, chase
away the fresh blood that I am working at bringing (and old faces I am contacting to bring back) to the echo.

You got it backwards. You started the discord with your actions.

His actions just woke you sleepers and caused you to lash out at whoever disturbed your complacency.

... PURITANISM: The hounting fear that someone, somewhere, may be happy.

--- BBBS/Li6 v4.10 Dada-2
* Origin: Prism bbs (1:261/38)

Richard Menedetter wrote to Allen Prunty <=-

It hasn't been relevant to you or anyone else since November 2015 so
why is it now?

It was and is relevant to me and others.

The fact that there was no message flow does not mean that we do not
care!

You would have found this out if you would have written a message here before hijacking it!!

If you cared you would have written more often, 'Weed

... A person is never happy except at the price of some ignorance.

--- BBBS/Li6 v4.10 Dada-2
* Origin: Prism bbs (1:261/38)

Hi Allen!

05 Jun 2016 18:47, from Richard Menedetter -> Allen Prunty:

You would have found this out if you would have written a message here before hijacking it!!

now it's an issue now that someone wants to restart and get this
going.

No issue at all if you want to contribute and write here.
No need to hijack the echo for that!

Allen did you reply to that comments?
I did not receive anything.

New blood is very welcome here!
Just bring them here, no need for echo hijacking!

If you want to oust me then you will need to go appeal to a
non-existant IC and get it declared international then go from
there. Please take any further comments to Netmail.

You did not answer that Netmail.
Your system is also not crashable.
Neither with IPv4 nor with IPv6.

CU, Ricsi

--- GoldED+/LNX
* Origin: Feel good? Don't worry; you'll get over it! (2:310/31)

Right now I'm in a bit of a crisis... no airconditioner and my house is a
metal clad mobile home style pre-fab. It's 110 degrees of higher I've had to evacuate. I'm connecting wifi at a friends house I'm not going to "Hijack" their router LOL.

Allen

Allen Prunty -- | Telnet to livewirebbs.com --
-- Derby City Livewire | -- where friends meet online

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A20 (OSX)
* Origin: LiveWireBBS.com * Louisville, Kentucky (1:2320/100)

Hi Allen!

16 Jun 2016 16:34, from Allen Prunty -> Richard Menedetter:

Right now I'm in a bit of a crisis... no airconditioner and my house
is a metal clad mobile home style pre-fab. It's 110 degrees of higher I've had to evacuate.

I hope that you get it sorted out!
Good luck!
(Had to check what 110 degrees Fahrenheit are in celsius ... over 43 ... wheeeeeew)

I'm connecting wifi at a friends house I'm not going to "Hijack" their router LOL.

;)
People with humour cannot be all bad ;)))

CU, Ricsi

--- GoldED+/LNX
* Origin: ... Scotty!, Hurry beam me u%#$& NO CARRIER-+- (2:310/31)

On 06/16/16, Richard Menedetter said the following...

I'm connecting wifi at a friends house I'm not going to "Hijack" thei router LOL.

;)
People with humour cannot be all bad ;)))

I'm not your bad guy Richard, and I don't see you that way eigher... I've
tried to poll you too no luck. We'll get it eventually. Where I'm at now
it's barely 81 degrees in here (that's 27.22 in celcius) tomorrow is my 45th birthday. Family is renting me a room at a hotel for the weekend at the Casino... I don't gamble I just go piddle enough to get a ticket for the free lunch and dinner buffet and get in the insdoor pools. I'm taking my computer there should be able to VPN tunnel on their connection.

Polling BINKP node 2:310/31
Connecting to fido.ricsi.priv.at
Connected
Session timeout
Authorization failed

Thanks for your understanding.

Allen

Allen Prunty -- | Telnet to livewirebbs.com --
-- Derby City Livewire | -- where friends meet online

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A20 (OSX)
* Origin: LiveWireBBS.com * Louisville, Kentucky (1:2320/100)

Hi Allen!

16 Jun 2016 18:50, from Allen Prunty -> Richard Menedetter:

I'm connecting wifi at a friends house I'm not going to "Hijack"
their router LOL.

;)
People with humour cannot be all bad ;)))

I'm not your bad guy Richard,

You really tried hard to convince me of your bad intentions!
No prior discussion in the echo, no reasoning why you could not simply participate without hijacking.

This whole mess would have been prevented if you would have written a message prior to your rash actions.
Similar to the Babylon 5 echo ... a bit of communication _BEFORE_ you act would have been nice!

Had to delete 170ish messages from 2014.

and I don't see you that way eigher...

That is understandable ;))
I did not hijack this echo.

I've tried to poll you too no luck.

I had 100s of in and outgoing connections.
My system is working fine.

The last one with you is this one:
+ 17 Jun 07:40:49 [32359] incoming session with 20.244-151-104.rdns.scalabledns.
com [104.151.244.20]
- 17 Jun 07:40:49 [32359] SYS Derby City LiveWire
- 17 Jun 07:40:49 [32359] ZYZ Allen Prunty
- 17 Jun 07:40:49 [32359] VER Mystic/1.12A20 binkp/1.0
+ 17 Jun 07:40:49 [32359] addr: 1:2320/100@fidonet
+ 17 Jun 07:40:49 [32359] addr: 901:1/12@dixienet (n/a or busy)
+ 17 Jun 07:40:49 [32359] addr: 1:2320/0@fidonet
+ 17 Jun 07:40:49 [32359] done (from 1:2320/100@fidonet, OK, S/R: 0/0 (0/0 bytes))

I deleted the NM, as it was not deliverable.
So there was no packet waiting for you.
BTW. good ... you fixed the domain for zone 901.
In your previous poll you still had it configured as "fidonet".

BTW. your system is again down.
See message in the IPv6 echo.

We'll get it eventually.

I hope so ;)

Polling BINKP node 2:310/31
Connecting to fido.ricsi.priv.at
Connected
Session timeout
Authorization failed

My BinkD shows me a correct session.
There was just no mail in either direction, as I deleted the NM after it was not deliverable for some days.

Very strange that your system says session timeout.
See my log above.

CU, Ricsi

--- GoldED+/LNX
* Origin: And on the seventh day He took an aspirin (2:310/31)

Hi Allen!

Your system is still not reachable:
fido@odroid:~$ poll 1:2320/100
13:44 [10544] BEGIN, binkd/1.1a-75/Linux -p -P 1:2320/100 /usr/local/etc/binkd.cfg
? 13:44 [10544] Cannot find domain for zone 1, assuming 'fidonet'
13:44 [10544] creating a poll for 1:2320/100@fidonet (`d' flavour)
13:44 [10544] clientmgr started
$ cd 1:2320/100@fidonet (hold until 2016/06/17 13:45:31)

fido@odroid:~$ cat outbound.001/09100064.try
Connection timed out

CU, Ricsi

--- GoldED+/LNX
* Origin: Genius has its limits, but not stupidity (2:310/31)

Hi Richard,

No prior discussion in the echo, no reasoning why you could not simply participate without hijacking.

As I mentioned to you in netmail, this area had not had a post since 2008.

That is more than "mostly dead" (Princess Bride)

Any posts made by Allen requesting what you call a "prior discussion" to his elisting of the echo, would have ended up in the Bit-Bucket.

Take care,
Janis

--- BBBS/Li6 v4.10 Dada-2
* Origin: Prism bbs (1:261/38)

Hi Richard,

You posted to Allen Prunty:

Hi Allen!

Your system is still not reachable:
fido@odroid:~$ poll 1:2320/100
13:44 [10544] BEGIN, binkd/1.1a-75/Linux -p -P 1:2320/100 /usr/local/etc/binkd.cfg
? 13:44 [10544] Cannot find domain for zone 1, assuming 'fidonet'
13:44 [10544] creating a poll for 1:2320/100@fidonet (`d' flavour)
13:44 [10544] clientmgr started
$ cd 1:2320/100@fidonet (hold until 2016/06/17 13:45:31)

fido@odroid:~$ cat outbound.001/09100064.try
Connection timed out

Allen has mentioned some intense heat problems in KY and having to stay away from home through out that.. I lived in the same area that Allen posts from and I can tell you the heat there can be really really bad. If your air conditioner goes on the fritz (as I believe Allen's did) it makes a place uninhabitable with the heat and humidity. I'm sure he'll be back to check out his system when he gets a chance.

Take care,
Janis

--- BBBS/Li6 v4.10 Dada-2
* Origin: Prism bbs (1:261/38)

Hi Janis!

17 Jun 2016 19:33, from Janis Kracht -> Richard Menedetter:

No prior discussion in the echo, no reasoning why you could not
simply participate without hijacking.

As I mentioned to you in netmail, this area had not had a post since
2008.

???
Where do you link to??
There is something seriously wrong with it.

The last message before the hijack is from myself:
From : Richard Menedetter 2:313/41.31 28 Nov 2015 18:40
To : Wilfred van Velzen 16 May 2016 18:38

I have joined in october 2015, and have 61 messages before the one above.

Any posts made by Allen requesting what you call a "prior discussion"
to his elisting of the echo, would have ended up in the Bit-Bucket.

We need to sort this out.
It seems you have a dead link if the last message that you have is from 2008!!!

CU, Ricsi

--- GoldED+/LNX
* Origin: Anyone could do it with manuals... (2:310/31)

Richard Menedetter wrote to Janis Kracht <=-

Hi Janis!

17 Jun 2016 19:33, from Janis Kracht -> Richard Menedetter:

No prior discussion in the echo, no reasoning why you could not
simply participate without hijacking.

As I mentioned to you in netmail, this area had not had a post since
2008.

???
Where do you link to??
There is something seriously wrong with it.

Yeah, there is. Jamis' Prism system is a major distribution hub for North America. Apparently you people who stayed behind in the "Old World" have been nattering amongst your own selves and not letting all of FIDO in on the conversations.

The last message before the hijack is from myself:
From : Richard Menedetter 2:313/41.31
28 Nov 2015 18:40
To : Wilfred van Velzen
16 May 2016 18:38

I have joined in october 2015, and have 61 messages before the one
above.

Check the origin lines and the "seen-by" data and you will see what I meant above.

Any posts made by Allen requesting what you call a "prior discussion"
to his elisting of the echo, would have ended up in the Bit-Bucket.

We need to sort this out.

Yes, you do. We're sorted already. It's you Zone 2 dudes who have your panties in a wad.

... Beautiful flowers die fast. Blooming idiots never do.

--- BBBS/Li6 v4.10 Dada-2
* Origin: Prism bbs (1:261/38)

18 Jun 16 07:21, you wrote to Richard Menedetter:

???
Where do you link to??
There is something seriously wrong with it.

Yeah, there is. Jamis' Prism system is a major distribution hub for
North America. Apparently you people who stayed behind in the "Old
World" have been nattering amongst your own selves and not letting all
of FIDO in on the conversations.

i've documented this in the past... not for this area but any areas that get disconnected for some reason or another... any systems that don't get the disconnect information and retain the area end up as little puddles... even if it is an accidental disconnection and no information is transmitted... if other systems are linked to those puddles, then you have a pond... none of the systems get any traffic in that area from outside the pond... no ponds are linked together so there's no traffic flowing between them, either... if a system has had to restore their config for some reason, it stands that the disconnected area may not even be listed in the restored config... so you end up with numerous disconnected puddles and ponds with no creeks or rivers connecting them... eventually someone may notice and start sending queries up the line which may or may not get things reconnected... it may be that they only get reconnected as far as the original break and no further until others notice and start the same process of getting reconnected... this same situation can also lead to folks assuming that an area is unmoderated when in fact they've simply been cut off from any traffic that may originate on the moderator's system...

)\/(ark

Always Mount a Scratch Monkey

... CAT.COM started. Computer will furball in five seconds.
---
* Origin: (1:3634/12.73)

Richard,

I can't find the last echomail message about your netmail because you have bounced this issue off of so many other echos. Mystic is pretty tempermental about banning IPs. Even though I have it set not to ban IPs it still bans
them for anything it sees as a denial of service attack.

Theses are all the IPs it banned last night alone. IF yours is among them
than that's probably why you can't crash through. I'm spending the weekend with family due to the heat and it's my birthday. I will be on and off
unless it bans my IP there too. I've reset everything. It especially does
not like european callers for some reason.

Allen

201.50.47.223
217.99.16.235
24.232.15.124
161.10.50.99
186.170.83.142
161.10.149.209
211.241.56.246
161.18.76.165
161.10.42.217
186.113.145.177
191.109.227.179

Allen Prunty ÄÄ Ý Telnet to livewirebbs.com ÄÄ
ÄÄ Derby City Livewire Ý ÄÄ where friends meet online

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A20 (OSX)
* Origin: LiveWireBBS.com * Louisville, Kentucky (1:2320/100)

tempermental about banning IPs. Even though I have it set not to ban
IPs it still bans them for anything it sees as a denial of service
attack.

and off unless it bans my IP there too. I've reset everything. It especially does not like european callers for some reason.

You do understand that these are ridiculous statements, right? It doesn't ban IPs magically, and it certainly doesn't have anything that somehow focuses on european callers...

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A20 (Windows)
* Origin: Sector 7 [Mystic BBS WHQ] (1:129/215)

tempermental about banning IPs. Even though I have it set not

to ban

IPs it still bans them for anything it sees as a denial of service attack.

and off unless it bans my IP there too. I've reset everything. It especially does not like european callers for some reason.

You do understand that these are ridiculous statements, right? It doesn't ban
IPs magically, and it certainly doesn't have anything that somehow focuses on
european callers...

No... it is banning north american ip's ... north korean ip's (those are
to be expected) tons of russian ip's.

I have it set not to ban ANY ip's. But I do see ip's banned from
Germany and the EU area where Rick is coming in from.

I don't understand why Mystic is banning any of them since I have it set
not to ban so I'm assuming this is why he's getting failed connections
trying to crash netmail over to me.

Allen


--- Platinum Xpress/Win/WINServer v3.0pr5
* Origin: LiveWire BBS - livewirebbs.com - Louisville, KY (1:2320/100)

On 06/18/16, Allen Prunty said the following...

No... it is banning north american ip's ... north korean ip's (those are to be expected) tons of russian ip's.

Wow, you must be more important that we all thought. You have North Korean IP addresses targetting your BBS? Impressive, seing that North Korea only has 175.45.176.0/22. That's 1024 individual IP addresses. For the whole country. And more than one of them is being used to target your BBS.

Ian

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A21 (Linux)
* Origin: The Parity Error BBS - Kelowna, BC, Canada (1:153/250)

I don't understand why Mystic is banning any of them since I have it set not to ban so I'm assuming this is why he's getting failed connections trying to crash netmail over to me.

I'm not really confident that you actually have it turned off based on previous experiences.

The code has been the same since 2011 when it was added in, and in the 5 years of it getting used every single day by many people, no one but you has ever reported a problem. I personally have ran it off for the past 5 years myself.

North Koreans do not have Internet, and to even own a computer I believe you need to be in the government, and only high ranking politcal leaders have actual Internet access!

Very interesting that its North Korea that Mystic is mysteriously blocking when its turned off!

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A21 (Windows)
* Origin: Sector 7 [Mystic BBS WHQ] (1:129/215)

No... it is banning north american ip's ... north korean ip's (those are
to be expected) tons of russian ip's.

Wow, you must be more important that we all thought. You have North Korean IP
addresses targetting your BBS? Impressive, seing that North Korea only has 175.45.176.0/22. That's 1024 individual IP addresses. For the whole country. And more than one of them is being used to target your BBS.

The IP's trace to Korea not sure honestly not sure if it's north or not.
I'm also getting traffic from Vietnam and mostly Russia.

Allen


--- Platinum Xpress/Win/WINServer v3.0pr5
* Origin: LiveWire BBS - livewirebbs.com - Louisville, KY (1:2320/100)

Hi Allen!

18 Jun 2016 09:40, from Allen Prunty -> Richard Menedetter:

I can't find the last echomail message about your netmail because you
have bounced this issue off of so many other echos. Mystic is pretty tempermental about banning IPs.

You can use goodip.txt, but I guess you migrated to another system.
Anyhow ... we found other ways to communicate ;)

CU, Ricsi

--- GoldED+/LNX
* Origin: Anything that is too stupid to be spoken can be sung (2:310/31)

Hi Dave!

18 Jun 2016 07:21, from Dave Drum -> Richard Menedetter:

As I mentioned to you in netmail, this area had not had a post
since 2008.

???
Where do you link to??

I have joined in october 2015, and have 61 messages before the
one above.

Check the origin lines and the "seen-by" data and you will see what I meant above.

Here is an example from late 2015:

S EEN+BY: 109/500 116/116 123/5 52 140 400 500 789 124/5013 5014 129/215

S EEN+BY: 135/300 140/1 153/757 154/0 10 701 203/0 226/600 227/51 101 201

S EEN+BY: 229/426 230/0 240/1120 5832 8002 249/303 261/38 280/464 5003 5006

S EEN+BY: 280/5268 292/624 854 310/31 313/41 320/119 322/759 340/800 342/11

S EEN+BY: 423/120 712/848 770/1 2432/390 3634/12

P ATH+: 123/140 500 154/10 280/464 5003 240/1120 313/41


I am not good at 2D address reading, but it looks extensive, and not like a Pond.

CU, Ricsi

--- GoldED+/LNX
* Origin: Both of his feet are firmly planted in the air (2:310/31)